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Back with CSM 1750pts

PostPosted: Thu Apr 05, 2012 8:06 pm
by Daimyo52
So after not playing for over 2 yrs I was walking around the Decimation tourney and kinda got the bug back, so I dusted off my CSM army and played a few games.

I found that the meta has moved way on from where it was and my list struggles quite a bit.

Used to run....... 2 Lash DP's / 2 x 7 PM's in rhinos / 9 Zerks in Landraider / 2 x 3 Oblits, found I could seriously do with more bodies on the ground and that the Landraider dies very quickly ( necrons / GK especially )

So decided to add some more troops and drop a DP and the LR

New List
Nurgle DP........ Wings

2 x 8 Zerks.......Champ PF / Rhino's
3 x 5 PM's........Champ PF / 2 x Melta each / Rhino's
3 x 2 Oblits.......

I have 34 pts left ( 1 troop or 2 plasmas for the Zerks )

for 2000 pts I have 5 bikers / PF / 2 melta but found them hard to use well

Do I need the 5th rhino or could I just boost a PM squad with the points.

Scraped a draw against a zandrekh / immortal heavy list last night and did find it a little harder to use the Zerks without the LR delivery system....

Wondering if a thosand sone unit instead of a Zerk unit to jump pout and Dakka ( the sorceror cost puts me off a little )

comment welcome

Re: Back with CSM 1750pts

PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2012 10:07 am
by Baragash
As they're in Rhino's I think you'll find regular CSM squads more effective and more flexible than Zerks. You can always take the Icon of Khorne if you miss the attacks.

I often use a unit of Sons at games over 1500pts. They actually have fantastic tarpit ability due to their 4+ Inv and Fearless. I've had them hold up elite combat units and monsters very handily on many occasions, using either Doombolt or Wind of Chaos on the Sorcerer.

Re: Back with CSM 1750pts

PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2012 2:59 pm
by killmaimburn
on mobile, low on juice. now is wrong time to move to Nurgle, lash is resurgent.
drop the power fist champ from plague marines, just dual melta, put together makes 2x3,1x2 oblits. on warseer if you can find me my Sig has a link to tips and tricks to lash.(can't link...silly phone)
how do grey knights put enough melta on the table to make you ditch your raider.Surely GK are a greater threat to T6, with a Str7/8 wall and combat buffs?

Re: Back with CSM 1750pts

PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2012 4:57 pm
by Daimyo52
It usually dies to the 3 PSI-rifle dreads........ it gets rended to death :(

Lash seems to be a bit less effective now you have to roll to hit ( and I sorta like T6 )

Re: Back with CSM 1750pts

PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2012 8:16 pm
by ruffian4
killmaimburn wrote:on mobile, low on juice. now is wrong time to move to Nurgle

Immobile, high on juice. Embrace an amble towards the great grandfather. :)

Re: Back with CSM 1750pts

PostPosted: Sat Apr 07, 2012 9:45 pm
by Daimyo52
So whats the thoughts on 2nd zerk unit versus Thousand sons unit and also wha t to add for 2000pts ?

Re: Back with CSM 1750pts

PostPosted: Sun Apr 08, 2012 11:27 am
by killmaimburn
Daimyo52 wrote:It usually dies to the 3 PSI-rifle dreads........ it gets rended to death :(

Pedant point, its not rending, but the end result is the same, psybolt ammo gives +1 strength, making the dual autocannons 4xstr8 shots.Either way he needs 6s to glance (and he has to get around smoke/cover possesion/EA and your obliterators really should be popping away at such easy AV12 targets :D )
I'd steer clear of 1ksons myself, even with the latest odd faq saying the sorceror and ICs although travelling through difficult terrain..didn't so aren't always int 1 on charge(finally they are starting to feel a tad guilty about what they did to them).

At 2000 are you still using just the standalone codex?
5 bikes 2 melta champ fist is 225? Relies on turboboosting to get to where its going.
Suggest 5 raptors 2 melta,twice, 240, 15 points more, brings in a second squad to come in from reserve and cut the head off the chicken through deepstirke.Brings twice as much anti tank inc kraks, brings more anti horde (through numbers) and even brings more attacks as the special weapons are added (rather than like in bikes case replaced), on charge both squads combined bring 30 attacks after bolt pistols.

Re: Back with CSM 1750pts

PostPosted: Sun Apr 08, 2012 1:17 pm
by Daimyo52
Guess my GK opponent must be mistaken about using rending ?

2nd unit of Zerks it is then and I'll look at raptors ( need to put some icons back in )
DS units a bit unpredictable when they arrive, is there anyway to control this. what about summoned lesser daemons for the sheer amount of extra bodies, but suppos not as survivable.

Wasn't sure about the question on standalone codex ( am I missing out on something )

Re: Back with CSM 1750pts

PostPosted: Mon Apr 09, 2012 2:13 pm
by killmaimburn
Daimyo52 wrote:Guess my GK opponent must be mistaken about using rending ?

I suspect so, but welcome people correcting me.
p94 for dreadnought options (No psycannons ,but there are autocannons, assault cannons)psybolt ammuniation discrption is on p62, you can have 1 rending assualt cannon bumped to strength 7 (24" range).. but not 2. You can have 2 T/L autocannons +1=str8, but the default state of weapon is not one with rending. Psybolt ammunition does not a psycannon make (in a lot of ways str8 is better, e.g. instant death against FNP units etc, comapred to rending needing to 6s to do that etc).


Daimyo52 wrote:Wasn't sure about the question on standalone codex ( am I missing out on something )
I just mean when you jump up a bracket do you change the ruleset, scenario, battlemission, involve imperial armour etc. Less conventional things we could stick in.

Suicide melta bad.. but there are worse things in the codex. :D

Re: Back with CSM 1750pts

PostPosted: Mon Apr 09, 2012 3:06 pm
by Daimyo52
He was using 2 x TL Autocannon with psybolt ammo so should be S8 no rending ? that correct

At 2000pts ( very rare for tourneys ) we still us ethe original codex............

what tournaments are you guys doing ?

Re: Back with CSM 1750pts

PostPosted: Tue Apr 10, 2012 11:36 am
by Ljundhammer
CSM is relatively boned at the moment. They are simply outclassed by every other Marine codex (except BT probably). There may, or may not, be a new codex coming soon, as well as 6th ed, so I'd resist the temptation to build too many toys into your army & just ensure you have the staples.

Anyway, the CSM codex can be broken down pretty easily:
Good:
Obliterators
Lash
Plague Marines
CSM squads
Rhinos
Kharn

OK:
Terminators
Raptors
Defilers
Havocs

So bad they're hilarious:
Spawn
Khorne lords
Special characters (except Kharn & Abbadon)

Bad:
Everything else

Run a list with that in mind & you should be ok.

Re: Back with CSM 1750pts

PostPosted: Tue Apr 10, 2012 2:11 pm
by ruffian4
Ljundhammer wrote:So bad they're hilarious:
Khorne lords.

A year opr two ago, I decided to get silly and took 2x khorne lords with daemon weapons (yes, I know) on juggernaughts vs bungles.

They both charged in the same turn, one at 10 man tooled up death company, one vs 10 man arse alt squad.

The death company went away completely which was hilarious.
The one against the arse squad boobed his daemon weapon rolled and twatted himself.
The arse alt squad caused no wounds on him at all, but he took a fearless clout due to the wound he caused himself and went the way of all flesh ... hilarious too but only about an hour later. :?

Re: Back with CSM 1750pts

PostPosted: Wed Apr 11, 2012 12:36 pm
by killmaimburn
On LHs critique
Havocs only ok in V particular builds, e.g. as double chosen spam or mass autocannon.
I'd say terminators have to be built properly too
Beserkers can be good but need a list that helps them hit.
I think you were on message until you tried adding bikes :D

Interestingly likewise negative piece just gone up at 3++ that might assist you.
http://www.3plusplus.net/2012/04/email- ... st-2k.html

On tournies, we had the AOS spring one, which we all pretty much sucked at. :fisticon :fisticon :fisticon . Bane is thinking of trying to grab a bunch of people for going to someone elses over summer if your cruising to go to something PM him and see if its one of the things he was thinking about, I think we've decided that the autumn meetup won't be a tournament(since we've had 6 or something in 3 years).