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Blood angel list

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Blood angel list

Postby Ljundhammer » Thu Apr 12, 2012 6:30 pm

Hello everyone!

I've made a blood angel list based on a few things which have been going around my head lately...

Fings wot I've bin finkin' abaat:
1) Everyone's got a blood angel list, there must be a reason
2) I played blood angels for about 10 years, all the way through 2nd ed & into 3rd
3) Mephiston is really quite good
4) I must do something with the vindicators in my loft
5) I need to do something with the massive amounts of space marines & rhinos I have hanging around

So here we go:

Blood Angels 1750 (1500 is for teh gayz)

HQ - Librarian - 100
Librarian - Shield of sang & blood lance

Elite - sternguard - 135
Sternguard - 2 x missile launchers

Elite - sterguard - 135
Sternguard - 2 x missile launchers

Troop - assault squad - 135
Assault squad - melta gun
Razorback - dozer blade, twin-linked heavy flamers

Troop - assault squad - 135
Assault squad - melta gun
Razorback - dozer blade, twin-linked heavy flamers

Troop - assault squad - 170
Assault squad - melta gun
Razorback - dozer blade, twin-linked assault cannon

Troop - assault squad - 170
Assault squad - melta gun
Razorback - dozer blade, twin-linked assault cannon

Fast - land speeder - 90
Land speeder - heavy flamer, typhoon missile launcher

Fast - land speeder - 90
Land speeder - heavy flamer, typhoon missile launcher

Fast - land speeder - 90
Land speeder - heavy flamer, typhoon missile launcher

Heavy - vindicator - 165
Vindicator - dozer blaze, extra armour

Heavy - vindicator - 165
Vindicator - dozer blaze, extra armour

Heavy - vindicator - 165
Vindicator - dozer blaze, extra armour

That's 1745 points!

Now, it looks a bit odd. Some of it because I couldn't fit Mephiston in :(

At the start I get a barrage of missiles off from the sternguard & typoons, the tanks can move 12" & shoot their guns.

In an ideal world I'll have a front row like this:
FAVAVVF
(where F = heavy flamer razors, A = assault cannon raozors, V = vindicator) That'll stop the sides of the vindicators being targetted , and with the librarian in the centre razor, I can cast sangine shield to get a cover save if I don't get one already to cover the assault cannons & vindicators. Obviously if it's a horde army I'll swap the assaault cannons & heavy flamers around.

The typhoons will lurk behind this front line & the sternguard will go where the cover & LoS is.

I've foregone my usual massive amounts of melta on the basis that I don't really care about Land Raiders & I've got 3 vindicators anyway!

Once I demech my opponent through the over-use of missiles, vinicator shells & assault cannons, then the army switches to anti-infantry with the typhoons closing in with the heavy flamers, the flamer razors and frags on the sterguard. I'm hoping I won't need to use the assault marines at all (other than the odd melta shot when they get shot out of their tanks) and they can concentrate on running to objectives & hiding.

I'm not sure if I have enough AT or Anti-Infantry if I'm honest... I think it's because I usually count melta guns, auto cannons & scatter lasers for that, which this list lacks in spades!

You'll note the vast swathes of dozer blades designed to keep the mech formation together without having to worry too much with terrain. And the extra armour on the vindi's - which looks quer, but if they lose a gun, I want to be able to keep the moving to:
1) hide rhinos behind;
2) tanks shock; and
3) ram stuff!

Well, that's my thought process on building this. Anyone got any comments on it effectiveness (other than vindicators - lol, which I take as read).
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Re: Blood angel list

Postby Stunty » Thu Apr 12, 2012 7:57 pm

meh I'll smash that list*







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Re: Blood angel list

Postby BANE » Thu Apr 12, 2012 9:59 pm

Seems solid enougj to me, one question tho.

How do you deal with mephi?
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Re: Blood angel list

Postby Ljundhammer » Fri Apr 13, 2012 8:04 am

Hmm, that's a good point. I suppose I've effectively dealt with him through MSU... He can only kill 6 things a game (assuming 7 turns & he's in combat on turn 2), if I kill everything else, I'll deal with him later I suppose *shrug*.

I'll have to think about that!
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Re: Blood angel list

Postby BANE » Fri Apr 13, 2012 8:44 am

TBH thats normally the correct answer. I only consider him a issue for elite forces any you have enough stuff to ignore him providing you keep spread out.
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Re: Blood angel list

Postby Baragash » Fri Apr 13, 2012 9:08 am

Not sold on either the Vindicators or the Heavy-Flamers TBH.
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Re: Blood angel list

Postby Ljundhammer » Fri Apr 13, 2012 9:29 am

Well no, that's kind of the point. I thought I try a different direction & see if it's viable, and if not, why not.

The more intersting question is why it won't work. I'll agree that I won't win hardcore tournament with it, but from what I can see I think it's pretty good for casual play/ softer tournys.

I'll need to batrep a test game against one of KMB's pansy lists.
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Re: Blood angel list

Postby BANE » Fri Apr 13, 2012 9:38 am

Trying to remember if BA vindis can move and fire because they are fast? If i am right with my rules BA vindis have a threat range of 36 which means they are not that bad.

Agree about HFlamer RBacks tho. Basic or ACannon for me.
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Re: Blood angel list

Postby killmaimburn » Fri Apr 13, 2012 10:09 am

Ljundhammer wrote: And the extra armour on the vindi's - which looks quer, but if they lose a gun, I want to be able to keep the moving to:.
So your saying that...when the vindicator has lost its big baddaboom, your spending a load of points, incase the now weaponless vindicater is shot at by an opponent thus losing you a turn where you might be close enough to ram?
Please, in which situation would you NOT want it shot at as a firemagnet by that stage of the game.


I recommend
Libby as is- although if your using lance consider rhino over razorback so he can see without having to climb out.,
Sterngaurd keep for now but review, (they're not a scoring backline in yours+can't set up in DOW.. you will get annoyed with them)
Troops- standard..but see *
Typhoons, urgh, go conventional heavy bolter, remember they can fire frag missiles AND heavy bolter whilst moving instead of zooming up and heavy flamering for anti horde.. it also keeps them ranged.
Dropping the extra armour on vindicators you've got enough redundancy, and by the time you want to suicide ram them, they will only be being shot at if you want them shot at.
* for 50 points now free either add a priest to one squad creating a FNP FC bubble for your troops (who otherwise are quite thin on the ground)
or have lone typhoon, pair of typhoons and a zoom zoom distraction MM attack bike.
=1750.
Yes of course this would wreck my bloodhammer and my siegewing. If you don't add the priest I think my bikes will take you.
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Re: Blood angel list

Postby Baragash » Fri Apr 13, 2012 12:54 pm

Vindicators are very much the Liverpool team of MEQ codices - they look good on paper but they don't deliver on a consistent basis due to poor side armour and one-scattering-gun syndrome. Fast ones are much better granted, but still...meh.

I've tried the side-protection thing myself with Rhinos, not worth the time or effort IMO.
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Re: Blood angel list

Postby Ljundhammer » Fri Apr 13, 2012 5:54 pm

OK, points taken on board. 3 Vindis are too much, they take away from my scoring units too much & are too hard to protect. With 2 it'll be easier to only show front armour while needing to be taken out by my opponent. EA is gone! 3 are a bit to unwieldy when the opponents in your face & you then can't shoot them!

On typhoon, yes, heavy bolters are a better option - I always forget about frag!

Lance is a nice thing to have hanging around, I'm hoping not to have to use it unless things are going badly.

Revised list: 1750 points

Librarian - 100 - lance, shield

Sternguard - 135 - 2 x missiles

Sternguard - 135 - 2 x rockets

ASM - 150 - infernus, meltagun - razorback, dozer, flamers

ASM - 150 - infernus, meltagun - razorback, dozer, flamers

ASM - 170 - meltagun - razorback, dozer, assault cannon

ASM - 170 - meltagun - razorback, dozer, assault cannon

ASM - 170 - meltagun - razorback, dozer, assault cannon

Typhoon - 90 - hb

Typhoon - 90 - hb

Typhoon - 90 - hb

Vindicator - 150 - dozer

Vindicator - 150 - dozer

1750 on the nose.

Net effect - lose a vindicator, gain an assault cannon, a melta gun, a scoring unit (better than FNP I think...) & 2 x infernus pistols.

Whadyathink?
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Re: Blood angel list

Postby killmaimburn » Sat Apr 14, 2012 8:32 am

Whilst I agree with Baragash that its lack of shots/weapons is a bad thing. I think a debate should pop up around the duplication.
People say "if your going to take them they only work if you take many".. to me this revised list looks a lot easier for me to take down.
What you've really swapped is an armour 13 for AV11 for the first couple of turns.
I can now focus my anti high AV on the 2 av13s, my rest on the speeders till they drop then the razors..
To me thats a much easier task for most armies.
BUT I appreciate that "this 100 point thing is crap until you spend 450 points on it" is daft.
Discuss :P
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Re: Blood angel list

Postby Ljundhammer » Sat Apr 14, 2012 2:57 pm

Yeah. The problem is that the vindis are so damned inefficient!

If I were to drop them for 3 preds then the list would be far better. But that isn't the point. I have 3 vindicatirs in a box and I'm damned well going to use them. The question is how, without making a list so bad that I'm spawn fodder.

BA is the only way I can think of. A mech variant is the only subset I cn think of. If I can make them work here then either:
My thinking is wrong; or
They're unusable. Which would be a great shame.
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Re: Blood angel list

Postby BANE » Sat Apr 14, 2012 4:07 pm

Replace your speeders with Baal preds then so you are now saturating the AV 12-13 range so enemy has to sort his target priority out which may increase your survivability overall.
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Re: Blood angel list

Postby killmaimburn » Sat Apr 14, 2012 6:58 pm

Vindies aren't terribly inefficient they are just slightly overcosted and work well on stuff that no one takes.(bring back the ordinance damage chart,get rid of multiple wounds immune to ID and cover that means you need 20 hits and they'd be ok)
Pushing first one through the Av13 machine gets you

libby as is.
1 sternguard unit 2 missiles.
1x asm melta sarge has a hand flamer razorback flamer (145)
1x asm melta sarge has a infernus pistol razorback flamer (150)
2x asm melta razorback t/l asscan
2 baals with t/l asscan and heavy bolter sponsons (145x2)
1 Ball with T/L super flamer and flamer sponsons (140)
3 vindicators with dozer blade.(150x3)
1750
6 fast av13s,4 razrobacks
There is a bit of fat in the sponsons and the pistol weapons. :(
(I'd be tempted to drop the last sternguard and some sponsons and get a flying librarian dreadnought for lols myself)
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