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Dark Eldar List Advice

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Dark Eldar List Advice

Postby BANE » Sat Dec 10, 2011 3:36 pm

Alright all, i have just started down the path of the DE so i am after some advice from the community on a 1750 list, you can either write a fully list or just suggest a must have unit, or even just argue pros and cons of weapons or upgrades.

Only consideration is that the army needs to be made from 2 DE megaforce boxsets, i would like it to be a competitive balanced list that can take on all comers in a tournie enviroment.

Thanks for any help in advance.
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Re: Dark Eldar List Advice

Postby Ogregut » Sat Dec 10, 2011 9:24 pm

You can have many different types of DE armies so my first question would be what HQ do you want to use?

Based on 2 megaforces you can have quite a fast army with the jetbikes. You can either go full out with 2 full units of 9 and just fly about doing 2 lots of 9d3 hits on a unit or what I would do is 2 units of 6 with 2 heat lances. This way you can tank hunt and then go slicing units and contest objectives.

With only one fast attack choice left you could go with one big unit of scorges or a smaller one. How you arm them depends on your role for them. Haywire blasters are the best for tank hunting with range over heat lances. For anti troops I would just go for the carbines as the chances are you will be moving with them meaning you'll only get 1 extra shot with a splinter cannon.

Troop wise, you have lots of choice. For warriors, Ive found the best way to arm them is with a slinter cannon and blaster. I also take a champ for the extra LD. For wyches, haywire grenades are a must. A champ with an agoniser is very nice. As for wyche weapons I wouldn't bother, Ive found them to make a squad over expensive.

I tend to put my warriors in raiders and have my wyches come from a webway portal tho wyches in raiders work. I wouldn't have warriors in the portal tho.

Speaking of raiders (and all other DE boats) I give mine night sheilds and flicker fields. The amount of times Ive past the 5+ save or had boltguns out of range has made the 20pts per boat a great investment. However dont expect your vehicles to last the battle as they tend to fall from the sky from an angry glance.

Heavy support wise, you will have 2 ravagers. On many lists you will see them armed with 3 dark lances, I arm mine with disintergators and never leave home without them. 18 S5 AP 2 shots is amazing and at 36" range you can sit back with them. I find I have enough anti tank in my army with the dark lances on raiders, wyches and trueborn blasters in venoms.

Which brings me nicely on to the 2 venoms you'll have. I would make a trueborn unit with 4 blasters to go tank hunting. Most tanks will die to 4 blasters and no footslogger likes the 12 poisoned shots from a venom!

An army I would make from the megaforces would look something like this

10 warriors, s.cannon, blaster, champ, raider, night shields, flicker field
2 x 10 wyches, champ, agoniser, haywire
10 wyches, champ, agoniser, haywire, raider, night shields, flicker field
5 scorges, 2 haywire blasters
2 x 6 jetbikes, 2 heatlances
4 trueborn, 4 blasters, venom, s cannon, night sheild
2 ravagers, night sheilds, flicker fields

For HQ I would have a hammie with a webway portal and maybe a cheap archon for added punch.

Hope this helps (and makes sense!) If you have any questions Im happy to help. If you cant tell I love the DE army!
Last edited by Ogregut on Sun Dec 11, 2011 5:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Dark Eldar List Advice

Postby da_grot » Sun Dec 11, 2011 12:10 am

I find if your going web way then you need to pretty much build your list around the concept, using units like hellions and beast masters.

At least 2 ravangers all with dark lances are a must. Dark matter weaponry looks really good on paper being able to pen everything on a 5+ however that is only a 33% chance and then you only destroy a vehicle again on a 33% chance so really you need to concentrate about 4 to 6 hits reliable to destroy (from my experience of course).

Trueborn with blasters in venoms are great I normally run at least two of these. I also really like wyches, must have haywires, but find that some warriors for objectives are needed as wyches tend to die if your using them as assault troops.

Really though this codex has a lot of different play styles and is on the whole really well written. Bar mandrakes which are useless unfortunately.
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Re: Dark Eldar List Advice

Postby BANE » Mon Dec 12, 2011 9:10 pm

I am struggling to get all the good stuff in!

Am leaning towards this,

* HQ (150pts)

* Duke Sliscus the Serpent

* Elites (317pts)

* Kabalite Trueborn
* 4x Trueborn
4x Plasma Grenades, 4x Shardcarbine
* Venom
Nightshield, Splinter Cannon

* Kabalite Trueborn
* 5x Trueborn
2x Blaster, Shardcarbine, 2x Shredder
* Venom
Splinter Cannon

* Troops (555pts)

* Kabalite Warriors
Blaster, Splinter Cannon, 10x Warriors

* Wyches
2x Hydra Gauntlets, 10x Wyches
* Hekatrix
Blast Pistol, Venom Blade
* Raider
Dark Lance, Flickerfield

* Wyches
2x Hydra Gauntlets, 10x Wyches
* Hekatrix
Blast Pistol, Venom Blade
* Raider
Dark Lance, Flickerfield

* Fast Attack (498pts)

* Reaver Jetbikes
Grav-Talon, 2x Heat Lance, 6x Jetbikes

* Reaver Jetbikes
Grav-Talon, 2x Heat Lance, 6x Jetbikes

* Reaver Jetbikes
Grav-Talon, 2x Heat Lance, 6x Jetbikes


* Heavy Support (230pts)

* Ravager (115pts)
Dark Lance, Dark Lance, Dark Lance, Nightshield

* Ravager (115pts)
Dark Lance, Dark Lance, Dark Lance, Nightshield


Basic premise is warriors sit on home obj in cover, wyches shoot forward and attack lead units, bikes hit the enemy back line and ravagers shoot down any threats in strict target prority order. Blasterborn either open mech for the wyches to assault or go tank hunting or work with the dukes poisonborn to open a mech then splinter the cargo to death.

Thoughts and cretiques welcome, thanks to orgegut and da grot for imput so far.
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PostThis post was deleted by BANE on Mon Dec 12, 2011 9:13 pm.

Re: Dark Eldar List Advice

Postby Ogregut » Mon Dec 12, 2011 11:08 pm

Solid list. The only things I would change is take off the plasma grenades on the trueborn, as you dont really want them in combat. I would also exchange the shredders for blasters. I would also defo take haywire grenades on the wyches, it allows them to take on anything.
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Re: Dark Eldar List Advice

Postby BANE » Tue Dec 13, 2011 12:32 am

I am worried that i dont have anyway for dealing with elite infantry, termis and fnp BA and such.
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Re: Dark Eldar List Advice

Postby killmaimburn » Tue Dec 13, 2011 12:46 pm

I really know next to nothing about DE, what with MR6 having vanished for most of the year, I've played against DE only once more than nids this year (taking them on once..maybe twice..I can't remember what happened when nige saw my army and jedi mind tricked me into him swapping from DE to guard)

I don't understand kabalites in elites, they are a rather flimsy glassknife troop choice.. which just about pull their weight..In elites they look rather meh.You haven't used all your troops slots, nor have you used a wizard to make stuff in other slots go into troops.

Odd thing I've been surprised by, in real world I've seen grotesques kick a ridiculous amount of tarpitting butt, (not mentioned much on the web)..hitting them on 4s then wounding on 5s and having to get through 3 wounds each(and starting with FNP).(or a bunch of cover and then FNP) They can hold up a bunch of (non charging) thunderhammers for a fair while..(just keep an eye on that terrible leadership)..borrow some ogres from gav and see if you can make them awesome. I fail on which cheap IC your meant to stick with them to make them str6 on the charge etc etc.
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Re: Dark Eldar List Advice

Postby Ogregut » Tue Dec 13, 2011 7:43 pm

BANE wrote:I am worried that i dont have anyway for dealing with elite infantry, termis and fnp BA and such.


Dont take dark lances on ravagers, take disintergrators instead.

As da grot said it take 4-6 dark lances to take out a tank which means 2 ravagers to kill something. Where you could use one trueborn squad, wyches or scourges and leave the ravagers to dish out 9 S5 ap2 shots which will make every BA player think twice.

At the throne of skulls I fought 2 mech marine armies, both asked how many dark lances I had, and both had a smug look on their face when I said 2. I then went on to beat both armies by using wyches, trueborn and hellions to kill tanks.

I honestly dont think dark lances are the best anti tank weapons, combat is.

@KMB, yes truebore are a glass hammer but then almost the entire army is. But your right about grotesques, they are very good. Im working on a coven army to take to next years throne of skulls.
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Re: Dark Eldar List Advice

Postby BANE » Tue Dec 13, 2011 8:24 pm

But without lances on the ravagers my AT is all sort range, i like a list that is flexiable enough for me to decide how i am going to use it when i see my enemy and the mission, without any long range AT i need to go to the enemy from the off, i am a marine player at heart so i like to be able to cover all bases. I do like disintergrators tho and feel they are more suited to ravs as you fire all 3 at one target and get good results, the lances either all 3 do nothing or you get one result making the other 2 shots meaningless.

If i do that where do i find my long range AT?

Where did you place at Thorne of skulls? I want this army to become my main tournie army so i can lavish some time on the modelling painting etc.
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Re: Dark Eldar List Advice

Postby BANE » Tue Dec 13, 2011 8:29 pm

@da grot, are you saying i need warrior squads to follow the the wyches to claim the objectives they die fighting for? This would then be 3 warrior squads, (1 to camp 2 to claim) i would need in my list which means i need to drop something!
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Re: Dark Eldar List Advice

Postby DaBoss » Tue Dec 13, 2011 8:48 pm

Having faced 4 different Dark Eldar forces with my Space Marines (twice with my Dark Angels DeathWing and twice with my Pre-Heresy Worleaters)
I've found the Ravagers with Dark Lances pretty poor, whereas the Disintegrators did much better, still worth having a few Raiders with Dark Lances.

As Ogregut says, take it to CC for killing vehicles. One of the reasons my force goes infantry heavy.

I had a game of Battle Missions against Little Chris and his 1750pt tournament army with my DeathWing (Belial, 3 x Terms and 3 venerable Dreads)
His Ravagers only managed to kill 3 Terminators and damaged a Dread.
I won 7 to 2 Kill Points.
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Re: Dark Eldar List Advice

Postby BANE » Tue Dec 13, 2011 10:03 pm

Phil, what where chris ravagers armed with?

I would quite happly take the dissis on the ravs if i could get long range AT elsewhere, that said its harder to find dissis on other platforms so ravs are an option. Whatabout a razorwing with dissis and missles for anti elite?
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Re: Dark Eldar List Advice

Postby BANE » Tue Dec 13, 2011 10:51 pm

List 2

Kabel of the Crimson Serpent (1750pts)
1750pt Dark Eldar 5th Ed (2010) Roster (Standard)

Selections:

* HQ (150pts)

* Duke Sliscus the Serpent

* Elites (288pts)

* Kabalite Trueborn (142pts)
* 4x Trueborn
4x Plasma Grenades, 4x Shardcarbine
* Venom
Chain-snares, Splinter Cannon

* Kabalite Trueborn (146pts)
* 3x Trueborn
3x Blaster
* Venom
Splinter Cannon

* Troops (475pts)

* Kabalite Warriors (115pts)
Blaster, Splinter Cannon, 10x Warriors

* Wyches (180pts)
* Raider
Dark Lance
* 10x Wyches
10x Haywire grenades

* Wyches (180pts)
* Raider
Dark Lance
* 10x Wyches
10x Haywire grenades

* Fast Attack (422pts)

* Reaver Jetbikes (156pts)
2x Heat Lance, 6x Jetbikes

* Reaver Jetbikes (156pts)
2x Heat Lance, 6x Jetbikes

* Scourges (110pts)
5x Scourge (110pts)

* Heavy Support (415pts)

* Ravager (115pts)
Dark Lance, Dark Lance, Dark Lance, Nightshield

* Ravager (115pts)
Dark Lance, Dark Lance, Dark Lance, Nightshield

* Razorwing Fighter (185pts)
Disintergrators, Flickerfield, Monoscythe Missile, Monoscythe Missile, Necrotoxin Missile, Necrotoxin Missile, Nightshield, Splinter Cannon


Dropped some upgrades and bikes, added fighter and scourges.
Not sure if its any better.
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Re: Dark Eldar List Advice

Postby da_grot » Tue Dec 13, 2011 10:53 pm

Purely from my experience I find that dissis are a waste of time. There are much better ways of taking out meq's and teq's. Ravangers are pretty much are only dedicated long range AT and in an edition that's dominated by tanks (on average 4-6 per game) so shouldn't be sniffed at.

The issue of CC tanks with deldar is you are so vulnerable. The amount of times I've haywired a tank with whyches for it to explode and kill most of them is ridiculous. A good rule of thumb is take as much dark matter weaponary until it seems stupidly beardy and then add more, only because it's not as good as you think it is.

We have AI fire comming out of our ears from warriors and venoms. Sure you need to put more fire power into units to drop them but that's how deldar work cripple units completely before they do it to you.

On the note of warriors to capture objectives this is just how I play and what I find works for me only because I like to throw whyches into the hardest thing I can find unitl my incubi swing by to show them how it's really done.
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