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Grey Knight lists!

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Re: Grey Knight lists!

Postby Bob_to_Some » Wed Apr 13, 2011 4:14 pm

I'd be tempted to go for an Assassin... Culexus are pretty nasty in GK armies, due to all the GK's being Pyskers. He can probably single-handedly kill a whole Warlock squad even if accompanied by WG?
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Re: Grey Knight lists!

Postby KInG » Wed Apr 13, 2011 4:57 pm

all GKs may be psykers in fluff, but in game they don't have that attribute, even though the brotherhood of psykers allows them to do a psychic power, IIRC.
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Re: Grey Knight lists!

Postby KInG » Wed Apr 13, 2011 5:01 pm

i'll retract that, seems they are all psyckers as per the brotherhood of psykers i mentioned.

ouch, in my list his gun could be firing: let me just add this up a sec...

oh dear this can't be right...

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Re: Grey Knight lists!

Postby KInG » Wed Apr 13, 2011 5:02 pm

vehicles have psychic pilots, are they psykers also, if so thats another 4 shots... 33
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Re: Grey Knight lists!

Postby killmaimburn » Wed Apr 13, 2011 5:07 pm

Brotherhood = "the unit counts as a single psyker"

Just checking king also read this
http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/po ... 54799.page
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Re: Grey Knight lists!

Postby Galador » Wed Apr 13, 2011 9:49 pm

killmaimburn wrote:Brotherhood = "the unit counts as a single psyker"

Just checking king also read this
http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/po ... 54799.page
go fight some dark eldar lols


Forget that thread, try looking at the Crucible of Malediction arguments people have done against me on Dakka. I have had every concievable notion thrown at me that the Crucible is an attack, but noone can tell me where it states that it is an attack, only that it forces a leadership test. Then, when they couldn't show me that, they tried to say that only the Justicar would die, even though they are counted as a single psyker. It is like a 12 or 13 page thread over there now, but after about pg 5 or so, they just kept recycling cause they couldn't convince anyone, so I only chime in on it now whenever someone actually brings up something new.

What is everyone here on AoS thoughts on the Crucible of Malediction vs. Grey Knights?
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Re: Grey Knight lists!

Postby Baragash » Wed Apr 13, 2011 10:08 pm

Brotherhood of Psykers > Crucible of Malediction.

Vehicles are not Psykers.

I've been following the Dakka thread since it's inception. If ever there was a bad advert for the gaming community, that was it.
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Re: Grey Knight lists!

Postby KInG » Wed Apr 13, 2011 11:43 pm

Oh KMB I hate you sometimes. I read that childish thread and now my head hurts.

Vehicles are not psykers. There done and dusted in one sentence.

So, eldar. Wraithguard and 3 wraithlords. Yuriel and warseer + 2 warlocks. Ouch time!!!! I couldn't get any powers off on three dice and stopped trying after the 2nd potw I incurred. :(

Next time I'll try DSing everything all on one flank. Stealing the int. didn't help either. :/
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Re: Grey Knight lists!

Postby Galador » Thu Apr 14, 2011 12:25 am

Baragash wrote:Brotherhood of Psykers > Crucible of Malediction.

Vehicles are not Psykers.

I've been following the Dakka thread since it's inception. If ever there was a bad advert for the gaming community, that was it.



The argument was never over the vehicles. I honestly don't mind them, as they will eventually get wrecked, or will deliver lovely things to beat up on to me, instead of me having to travel all the way across the board to hurt them!

The discussion was about the Crucible vs a regular GK squad. If it was an attack or not, and if the BoP rule negated it or if it effected the whole unit, seeing as they count as a single psyker. My view as that it is not an attack, because every instance of an attack that you find in the rulebook either caused wounds, or caused a damage result on the vehicle chart. Also, the argument of whether it was a weapon or not didn't work either, as it was never shot, and it did not have a profile like a shooting weapon. Basically it boiled down to noone wants something to be decent against the BoP rule, and that GW will more than likely rule in favor of the GK, as they are the newest flavor of Space Marines, so they would win out once the FAQ arrives. But until then, I will stand by my arguement that it is a characteristic test, not an attack, and that it would remove the entire unit instead of just the Justicar. But hey, who knows, maybe someone hear can come up with a better debate than the guys at Dakka did. I have always loved a good debate, just ask time! :lol:
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Re: Grey Knight lists!

Postby Baragash » Thu Apr 14, 2011 12:59 am

I understand exactly what the debate is about.

You can't have it both ways. Either it's an attack by the basic dictionary definition. Or if you want to make a contextual argument [about the nature of "attacks"] then you don't get to pick and choose. In the context of the gaming system, the very existence of the BoP rule holds a much clearer, and more obvious contextual significance than whether or not there is a tighter meaning of "attack".

GW aren't going to rule in favour of BoP because of any favouritism towards GK, they're going to do it because that's the whole point of BoP in the first place, and just because they didn't check every single anti-psyker rule to make sure they met a particular definition of "attack" that they aren't aware exists or don't care if it does, doesn't suddenly make them flavour-of-the-month fanboys.

And for the record, I have a Dark Eldar army (and am working on a Daemon one and I think the GK Codex is terrible), so I have no motivation to fanboy on GKs either.
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Re: Grey Knight lists!

Postby Galador » Thu Apr 14, 2011 2:13 am

Honestly, I gave up on the debate long ago because plain and simple, everyone is going to see it their way, especially when you can't get a clear answer. Do I think the CoM is covered under the rules for BoP? No, because it is a characteristic test. Do I ever plan on incorporating one into my list? Maybe in a fun game, just to mess with a few friends that I game with, but in a competitive list? Never, because it is too limited in its uses, especially when I could bring a shattershard instead.

Sorry if I offended Baragash, didn't mean to. :oops: If I was the GK player and a DE player brought this up against me, it would make for a great debate, but I would honestly probably just dice roll them for it at most. Debating something for more than 2-3 minutes in a game is just not worth it, in my opinion. I would rather roll a die and get on with the fun, and then debate afterwards in a friendly matter.

But oh well, to each his own, and of course, it is simply something that will eventually get FAQed one way or another.

On a totally different topic, how do you run your Dark Eldar?? :lol: :lol:
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Re: Grey Knight lists!

Postby Baragash » Thu Apr 14, 2011 11:02 pm

I wasn't offended ;)

There are times when rules are genuinely unclear, and there are times when the option between an absurd and a non-absurd reading are divided by one side taking a disingenuous starting position when there's clear context (Chaos Dreadnought RAW is another good example*). My interest is in playing a game fairly balanced for everyone, not humping one army or another using gaps in GW's inability to write rules using a process flow with consistent terminology.**

*Though I advocate playing RAW on the Chaos Dreadnought, I am at least clear about my starting position and that I am trying to loophole the rule.

**And this is part of the reason the GK Codex sucks. GW not only failed to learn the lesson of Lash - don't write rules that aren't fun to play against - they gradually being writing more of them, Space Wolf Rune Priests, Death Mask of Sanguinius, Mephiston for example, and the GK has raised the bar.
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