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Allies

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Allies

Postby Cuv » Mon Jul 09, 2012 5:01 pm

hello all,

was having a think about allies in 40K lately and i am just wondering what combinations people may or may not take, if any.

i have two armies, space marines and orks.

for the orks i was considering having some chaos marines, THQ dawn of war style

not sure for the space marines though, guess that's why i was curious about what other people might do.

:)
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Re: Allies

Postby Stryder » Mon Jul 09, 2012 5:10 pm

depends on the chapter of space marines you use because some of them can use orks but me personally ill be using Tau as i was gunna collect them as my next army
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Re: Allies

Postby Cain Tiberius » Mon Jul 09, 2012 6:15 pm

Beyond finishing my Blood Angels, Idon't really want to throw any more cash at GW. But I'll probably end up doing so anyway... In which case I'd probably add IG and Eldar... Possibly Tau at the very outside..

I do plan adding units only available in other Marine Codecies, painted up as BA but using Allies rules.

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Re: Allies

Postby Ogregut » Mon Jul 09, 2012 6:44 pm

Planning on adding Fabuis Bile and some GM chaos space marines to my Coven themed Dark Eldar.
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Re: Allies

Postby Cuv » Mon Jul 09, 2012 10:00 pm

yeh i do like how they put in bold in the rules that you have to use a different codex from your primary one lol for your allies
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Re: Allies

Postby Angelwing » Tue Jul 10, 2012 7:53 am

well my grey knights, inquisition, battle sisters, guard and space marines will be using the occasional allies from each other. I won't for any other army of mine.
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Re: Allies

Postby Ljundhammer » Tue Jul 10, 2012 8:22 am

DeathWing + Mephiston & jump troops for me.

IG & whatever I fancy (likely a carapace vet guard list with Sisters allies for the penitent engines)

I need to get my Tau done :)
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Re: Allies

Postby ruffian4 » Tue Jul 10, 2012 9:20 am

Will see what cultists look like for chaos, but in mean time, my zombie guardsmen for death guard and ork beastmen for world eaters.

My reneguard will get death cult assassins (purestrains) + coteaz (magus) + eversor (broodlord) to revive my stealer cult.
Have already got 3 metal hybrids done for my ccs/pcs leaders and have a load of plastics that will be sergeants.
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Re: Allies

Postby cgra1 » Tue Jul 10, 2012 11:44 am

Im thinking about adding Orks to my Necrons, Only because it will annoy so many fluffy players :twisted:
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Re: Allies

Postby Herne » Tue Jul 10, 2012 12:35 pm

The allies rules worry me slightly. It's gonna be so easy to break standards and beard out. For eg: Epidemius and a couple of units of daemons in with plague marines. T5 and AP2 boltgun army with feel no pain and a 3+ save anyone? Cheeeeeesus! :D
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Re: Allies

Postby killmaimburn » Tue Jul 10, 2012 1:30 pm

Herne wrote:The allies rules worry me slightly. It's gonna be so easy to break standards and beard out. For eg: Epidemius and a couple of units of daemons in with plague marines. T5 and AP2 boltgun army with feel no pain and a 3+ save anyone? Cheeeeeesus! :D

Remember your having to kill 15 plus people with the right weapons to start that stuff and it has to take place whilst EPI is alive on the table (getting the right bit able to deploy and safe) and the epi tax is followed by needing plaguebearer (bodyguard+/ troop choice,non synergy to meq tarpit slow thing) or something else so it’s a 310 points min.. and as soon as you try to fill weaknesses with something non nurgle (something fast, something with melta, something guard) your not working towards unlocking or using your buff.
Honest I drafted a list and after posting it threw it away (you can see the this post was deleted by KMB in lists) as too vulnerable and mish mashy. Yeah demon princes everywhere.. but they already have all the stuff, they are just part of how you unlock(the other 600),If plague marines had plague swords so I could start wounding stuff, better than new school furious charge, before half my opponent is already dead..might be a different story.
Really can you begrudge the idea that GW may sell some nurgle bikes this decade now? :D

Cgra and LH have it.. basically everyone just gets the good units now to fix the power spiral. Guard and necron fliers I’ll stick some of them in my gash codex that no sane person would use suddenly its functional again. Oh man I got totally nerfed not getting thundernators cheap.. now I can. It instantly balances every codex by making it pick and mix. (pick and mix psychic powers have made up for the terribly drab CSM powers=bump same with DA).. Which is what the people demanding GW be like other game systems wanted. LHs first words out his mouth when I cast a spell was "F*&%* me they played too much warmachine"

TBH trialling fateweaver and seeing how much everything is about ap nothing mass str 6-7 weapons I think he’s toast I’m surprised they overtly did something to reinforce autocannon spam which in my world was already everywhere.

Yep, as listed in the other threads.
I like having my mono tzeentch, mono nurgle and (yet to try) mono khorne (poor poor khorne) back.
I have no idea who to allie my orks with, my kan wall is doomed, but nightfight everywhere makes my greentide good. I probably should blend it with LHs Tau for a natural allie.
All my smurfs and smurf lites can get access to stuff they dreamed of, like everyone else.
My 180 or so foot guard thing will wait for cultists, same boat as ruffian on them, but mine look like crap.
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Re: Allies

Postby ruffian4 » Tue Jul 10, 2012 2:47 pm

ruffian4 wrote:and ork beastmen for world eaters.

Think I need to qualify this then ...
I mean I will go out, buy and paint beastmen models, with axes and pistols, have them led by a nob with a big choppa (can't really justify klaws/ shootas/ burners etc to a reasonable level).

Certainly don't mean use ork models and bend over backwards ally justification for them being there (mercs be damned in most cases).

For me, its a matter of why you do what you do and how you do it.

As a fluff minded player, yes, necrons with orks would be mildly annoying (but fair do's, whatever you want), but necrons + guardsmen (or whatever) with weird controlly bits on their heads would be far more satisfactory.

But ...

... slippery slope time.
Re beastmen, I started wondering which types to use for what.
Gors vs. ungors = problem 1.
Not sure which one, but I prefer the looks of the gors, fine.
But, this got me to thinking, I could have more than one set of footslogger types.
Hmmm ...

Bestigor nobs and a minotaur boss??? = sounds cool, again no klaws, just big choppas.

Power-game head (or is it just reasonable???) went "I know! Ungor boys kommando gors, with boss whathisface outflanking from oppo table edge! That's more like the way beastie boys operate in fantasy, isn't it?"

Straightaway, starts me wondering if I'm doing the right thing.

Had a chat to Stargod about it, and his immediate reaction was "cover holes in your army" at which point me, the fluffy bunny moaned "no, that's the last thing you should be doing!"

This, of course, after giving chaos marines a skirmish screen (not so bad, if cultists really do appear), but also behind the lines skirmishers!
An ig force with power weapon assaulty types!

:evil: :evil: :evil: :| :| :| 8O :D :oops:

I really like the idea of allies, but always end up second-guessing myself about what is ok and what's not.
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Re: Allies

Postby Ljundhammer » Tue Jul 10, 2012 3:16 pm

killmaimburn wrote:LHs first words out his mouth when I cast a spell was "F*&%* me they played too much warmachine"


This is true, and I stand by it. Warmachine attempts to balance the game by making everything broken & mutually interactive. The whole "buffs on buffs" principle (as described by KMB in his first game of 6th). In effect, by adding allies and messing with the availability of flyers & Hammernators (which is pretty much what it boils down too) with all armies (except lolanids), every army now has the 'new cheese' (TM Privateer Press).

@Ruffian - it's a big galaxy. Pretty much anything you can think of in the fluff has probably happened somewhere. Yes, even rule 34.

Your beastmen idea is very nice - takes me back to my youth! As IG conscripts are majorly arse, beastorks seems like a nice replacement. I'd argue that power claws are justifiable, after all, IG messes with the heads of Ogryn leaders to make them better at what they do, why not add a smashy claw to the beastman leader on top of that to ensure all the others look up to him & don't try to challenge his status.

Edit - and beastmen are known a shamany-type characters - why wouldn't he have a chemical/alchemical concotion he can blow from a blow pipe (or something) which would act as a flamer?
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Re: Allies

Postby Herne » Tue Jul 10, 2012 6:28 pm

killmaimburn wrote:Remember your having to kill 15 plus people with the right weapons to start that stuff and it has to take place whilst EPI is alive on the table (getting the right bit able to deploy and safe) and the epi tax is followed by needing plaguebearer (bodyguard+/ troop choice,non synergy to meq tarpit slow thing) or something else so it’s a 310 points min.. and as soon as you try to fill weaknesses with something non nurgle (something fast, something with melta, something guard) your not working towards unlocking or using your buff..

Shouldn't be too hard - plasma toting chosen / LC toting chosen with MofN should do it. Be interesting to try out anyway. THink the primary delay to effectiveness would be the high PV of both the character and his PBtax and also the high pv ogf nurglemarines anyway.

killmaimburn wrote:Really can you begrudge the idea that GW may sell some nurgle bikes this decade now? :D..

Will be digging mine back out! :D :D :D

Yet to play with other list combos, but ultimately I hope that adoption alone will cover the danger of power creep if absorbed by new playstyles amongst players.
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Re: Allies

Postby killmaimburn » Tue Jul 10, 2012 7:51 pm

Herne wrote:
killmaimburn wrote:Remember your having to kill 15 plus people with the right weapons to start that stuff and it has to take place whilst EPI is alive on the table (getting the right bit able to deploy and safe) and the epi tax is followed by needing plaguebearer (bodyguard+/ troop choice,non synergy to meq tarpit slow thing) or something else so it’s a 310 points min.. and as soon as you try to fill weaknesses with something non nurgle (something fast, something with melta, something guard) your not working towards unlocking or using your buff..

Shouldn't be too hard - plasma toting chosen / LC toting chosen with MofN should do it. Be interesting to try out anyway. THink the primary delay to effectiveness would be the high PV of both the character and his PBtax and also the high pv ogf nurglemarines anyway.
Yes but, exactly like my demon prince description, as an unlocker you get no beneifit from them..
You (not accusatory, just phrasing) have just spent another 235 (if min without transport) on something that cannot recieve the FNP (as they didn't have it to start) and who don't get ap2 bolters, because you bought them ap2 guns already.

Making it actually broken relies on the premise being secure (300 min) the fire that melts off the locks (demon princes, chosen plas 800 ish) and then something to actually benefit from it so lets say non min maxed (as they have to survive and they are your core troops) 2x10 plague marines led by fist in a rhino=650 that is your 1750(and then it needs a chaos HQ to be rules legal). Not really broken.. fragile if the DPs fail to land or get shot quickly, needs them for killing men AND for killing tanks (as ignoring armour saves doesn't=ap1) AND for grabbing fliers out of midair.
Its messy :D
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