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New SM codex.

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New SM codex.

Postby KInG » Tue Sep 17, 2013 10:50 pm

All I've heard about it so far is:

- put Sammael ally in with whitescars giving them a 2+ cover save all the time the TBoost and 3+ any other time.
- points costs are cheaper across the board.

any other great revelations?
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Re: New SM codex.

Postby BANE » Wed Sep 18, 2013 9:16 am

Whitescars bikes are better and cheaper than RW.
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Re: New SM codex.

Postby killmaimburn » Wed Sep 18, 2013 7:20 pm

But not troops. :(
(until the rumoured £30 addon comes out)
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Re: New SM codex.

Postby lostandthedamned » Wed Sep 18, 2013 8:13 pm

The New Marine Unit can be a hard counter for the last two codexes new units.
Devastator Centurions w/ Grav cannon and Amp.
15 shots AP 2 @ 24" range for the minimum sized unit. Wounds on your armour save with re-rolls. Very nice against Riptides and Wraithknights.
Grav is also great on bikes for dealing with the same cheaply as 2x grav +combi-grav on sgt is only 113 pts.

I'm personally going to go back to Tactical Spam. I don't have to pay for Vet Sgts so I could fit 60 tactical, 20 assault and 20 devastator + 2 100pt characters @ 2000pts. Being Ultramarines is now great. Guiding 60 marines for free for a turn is very good but the devastator doctrine may need an FAQ. Relentless devastators for a turn is cool but rerolling my entire armies snap shots is even better as it works when you get charged at the moment.
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Re: New SM codex.

Postby BANE » Wed Sep 18, 2013 9:08 pm

killmaimburn wrote:But not troops. :(
(until the rumoured £30 addon comes out)


Bike squads of 5+ are troops with Khan or master/captain on bike and that goes for all chapters.
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Re: New SM codex.

Postby KInG » Thu Sep 19, 2013 1:03 am

so not a great deal in it then :(
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Re: New SM codex.

Postby killmaimburn » Sat Sep 21, 2013 7:37 pm

lostandthedamned wrote:I'm personally going to go back to Tactical Spam. I don't have to pay for Vet Sgts so I could fit 60 tactical, 20 assault and 20 devastator + 2 100pt characters @ 2000pts. Being Ultramarines is now great. [..]but rerolling my entire armies snap shots is even better as it works when you get charged at the moment.

I see Lh grinding his teeth at the increased time of rerolling 100 minis shots :lol:

KInG wrote:- points costs are cheaper across the board.

BANE wrote:
killmaimburn wrote:But not troops. :(
(until the rumoured £30 addon comes out)


Bike squads of 5+ are troops with Khan or master/captain on bike and that goes for all chapters.

Reheheheaallly???
Ok I'll have a read through (not for borkens yet, just for new for old) haven't looked at the rest of the web in a week or 2

Space marine captain on bike with artficer armour relic blade and combimelta 190
4bikes+MM attack bike (2 plas) 195
4bikes+MM attack bike (2 plas) 195
4bikes+MM attack bike (2 melta) 185 (765 of bike and troop)
Thunderfire-100
Scouts sniper rifles,missile telion135
Aegis with qaud..telion fires quad for all sniping all the time.. 100

==1100
----
NOW
HQ for 190 I can take a chapter master with arty armour, relic blade bike (gives me an extra wound and orbital bombardment on last guy.) Heck we'll add back the combimelta=200
Troops Bikes basic sarge (we don't need no stinking badges)2 default guys have 2 plas add one regular joe (grenade thrower in 6th) and MM attack bike= 5 bikes troops costs 169
x2
x3 melta instead of plas 159
thunderfire still 100, (now has barrage stuck on everything).
Scouts can't take telion as he's an ultrasmurf.. but the unit (cloaks rifles and missile launcher)- cost 79
Aegis unchanged.. other than regualr sarge firing it not telion

966

So 1100 becomes 966- Gains Chapter masters wound and orbital bombardment, we gain the barrage of thunderfire.. we lose leadership and some "fighting" (bikes fighting?) skill. We lose telion.. We gain Better hammer of wrath, we gain Hit and run across the board (better than old chapter tactics) back to the 3+/4+ of 5th ed for the bikes... and saves 134 points Nice.
Old
Captain on bike with lightning claw and artificer armour. 165
Bike squad 2 melta MM attack bike 185
Bike squad 2 melta MM attack bike 185
Bike squad 2 melta MM attack bike 185
Bike squad 2 plasma MM attack bike 195
Single MM speeder 60
Autolascannon pred 120
Autolascannon pred 120
Autolascannon pred 120
=1335

New
That captain costs 145
#1 As above those bikes now cost 169
#2
#3
#4 As above those bikes now cost 179
Speeder Same 60
Autolascannons 115 x3

-1076

Some darn fine savings there.

Silly thing I notice, leadership will be a real problem so I might actually need to buy those termie honours back..oh noes..
I was thinking about chucking in sicarious to fix this (until I remembered about the lockdown of chapter tactics).. so then (whilst still under this illusion I was working out how to fit a cheap bike leader in, with a role..

Silly build mod #1
Captain in arty armour on bike with primarch's wrath 150 (bike move as stationary..constantly pump out 4 shots
+3 heavy bolter attack bikes (135 points)..19 shots a turn for 285, 9 wounds (high T jink etc).
Comparisons
5man dev 4 heavy bolters- now 110 (12 shots but static)
Dakka Pred is now 95 (8 shots)
Dual Heavy bolter speeder Still 60 points (6 shots)
Centurian Devs..(really bolters meh on these guys as they need to just sit on cover even more than devs do) missiles and T/L heavy bolter 230 6 wounds 3 templates T/L 9 shots.

So after that..I came to the conclusion that 6th ed still doesn't like smurfs to be a mass fire army. :roll:

So anywhoo.. Iron hands
lets see Master of the forge is actually 10 points cheaper, he loses the ability to take a thunderhammer, but bikes are grotesquely cheap (last codex remember they were 35 points) so the conversion beamer on bike toting master of forge,who I built but could never points wise afford to field, has gone from 155 to a snip at 130- Not bad (not great but not bad).
I think 20 points for +1 T and more bolter shots is just required.. so lets just called master of the forge 110 points and assume he always had that bike. power axe or conversion beamer.. one or other not both.. I'd suggest power axe.. just because the idea of iron hands here is fixing stuff.. so why dump your tool kit?
Needs 5 or more, +1 to result for servo harness, +1 for iron hands= 3+s
techmarines with a harness are totall crap (well they were last time, but now compared to the MOTF its only 15 points different for the radically worse statline).. here not having lots of wounds means they'll NEVER use it will not die..
So unless your using a cheap bike captain (see above).I'd just take 2 master of the forges on bikes.


Riflemen are 120(still not reduced due to GK ones or anything)
Ironclads are still the same, flamer melta in pod is still 180.
Thunderfires are a bit better (ignores cover vs the prevelance of night fight etc.).. but
centurians gaining both feel no pain and (their sargent)IT will not die is quite sexy.
landraiders with it will not die, fairly sexy.. Means they can ignore long distance lascannons and regen.. but because they are transport boats they are going to have to get waayy to close to melta to take a penetrate and not guarentee going pop.. so really the main benefectors of it will not die will be the storm ravens with their moderate Av high hit points, and flyer status.. adding it will not die.. Noice..

Subsequent servitors got 5 points cheaper each but mindlocked is still a 50/50 gamble, 60 points for 2 plasma cannon guys who fire 50% of the time... I think other codexs have stuff I'd stick in instead.. not sure. EDIT- i guess I could have them hang out in cover and occasionally have conversion beamer guy hang out with them..

Ruleswise are vehicles also models? (They may be but they don't take wounds, so FNP doesn't work ignore me)..

Thing that makes me sad?? You know my DA assualt squad thing 2 flamers combi-flamer in a drop pod for dirt cheap.. would be so sweet twinned with salamanders rule (of rerolling to wound and pen etc).. well they kneecapped it, the sarge on just that unit and vanguard can't take combis(/ranged armoury)...DOH!! :violent5 :violent5 :violent5 :cry:
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Re: New SM codex.

Postby Ljundhammer » Sat Sep 21, 2013 9:05 pm

C+P the old codex;
Change a few special rules;
Add broken units for £££;
Reduce costs all round so that you can add a tau/ more space mahrinz ally for £££.

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Re: New SM codex.

Postby Baragash » Sun Sep 22, 2013 9:51 am

The end of a Black Crusade is heralded by the release of a new SM Codex to rub the relative points values and flavour rules in Abaddon's face, forcing him back to the Eye to cry bitter tears into his morning Khorneflakes.

This sentence also works if you replace "Abaddon" with "Bara".

Time to paint strip those Space Marines I've got and repaint them methinks. Oh and what's this....1200 points of Tau I bought when they were originally released and never used....? ;)
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Re: New SM codex.

Postby killmaimburn » Sun Sep 22, 2013 10:29 am

Ljundhammer wrote:C+P the old codex;
pretty much, well no pretty, MUCH. The last one got a lot less hate than the one before.
Ljundhammer wrote:Change a few special rules;
as in above but update them, yes as its a copy pasta
Ljundhammer wrote: Add broken units for £££;
I don't really see broken new shiny.. the set up Latd is talking about is 250points for 6 no invulnerable wounds (3 wounds if hit by str 10 ordinance).As guard I'd be laughing my ass off at spazz marines new shiny, same for if I was crons or any of the other consistent heavy hitters.
Yes on bikes its cheap, and I shall be taking 4 just to put the final nail in people thinking riptide/deathknight things are "funneh" but thats their points awesome target..won't graze lots of things I want rid of.

Ljundhammer wrote:Reduce costs all round so that you can add a tau/ more space mahrinz ally for £££.
Its true(although tiny in most regards, e.g. sarge when readdding honours, just like grumbles when they increased by 1 point for frag and krak and X and Y back in the day)..re bike (the big change) although bikes being distinctly middle tier seems to have got pretty much all my 1850 bike lists to now be 1500 bike lists. woo back in the game.

Ljundhammer wrote:I love it. Suckers.
We know you do , you look alll pepped up and ready to go for a 1500 battle.

Yeah Chaos got kicked in the nutts, darn DA templatey awesomeness.. still at least smurfs don't get infravisors.

(on the haters side.. a relic blade isn't a relic...taken from the ancient artifacts of chaos 3.5(UNIQUE dark blade), added into generic smurf power spiral.. when stuff goes back to artifacts ITS a NORMAL weapon ..FFS)
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Re: New SM codex.

Postby KInG » Tue Sep 24, 2013 12:53 am

darn DA templatey awesomeness..

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Re: New SM codex.

Postby Baragash » Tue Sep 24, 2013 9:10 am

I assume it's a reference to this being the second money grab cycle Codex cycle in a row where the CSM & DA Codices have been released, then shortly after they have been unmasked as the turds they really are by the attention lavished on the SM Codex.
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Re: New SM codex.

Postby Ljundhammer » Tue Sep 24, 2013 10:33 am

That would never happen!

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