I'm just curious, what three things would you change about codex: Tyranids, an why?

~Murphey

Psychic Scream doesn't stack, cause I hate it.
Genestealers aren't initiative 6, cause I hate it.
Not ALL tyranids get move through cover, cause I hate it.

The last one I'm of mixed opinion as to:

Fleshhooks cost 5 points per model, cause I hate them.

(grins)
(hope you weren't really looking for a serious post from ME.)

Rules bought into line with 5th ed.
Points bought into line with 5th ed.
Addition of malefactor, exocrine, dactylis and haruspex. No need for model releases, they can be modelling projects or forgeworld. (or for armorcast owners...)

And number four bonus: Pics of non studio armies in painting section.

I agree with rules updates and points updates but in addition I would change:

Lictor not rolling on deep strike mishap table because they always have to deep strike into cover.

Ravagers allowed to assault from Deep Strike since currently they will pop out, shoot and next turn to turned into expensive mush.

New weapon biomorphs to combat buff to vehicles in 5th Edition I don't know something like:

Spike Cannon

This weapon has only been seen recently on Tyranid Creatures that have been adapted to taking out fortifications and armoured vehicles at range to allow the swarms of smaller creatures easier access. Some have theorised that this is a new tactic being employed by the hive mind to speed up seiges. Reports have shown rather bloated and slow Tyranid Warriors with the weapon grafted into part of their exoskeleton commonly built into the shoulder or taking the place of two limbs on one side.

S+3 (max 10)
Counts as two weapon biomorphs on non MC models.
Ranged Rending: On a roll of 6 to hit an extra D3 is added to the penetration roll.

Assualt(1)

Give it a simular price to a Venom Cannon and hurrah Tyranids can kill vehicles that move!

Angelwing wrote:And number four bonus: Pics of non studio armies in painting section.

interesting one, why's that?

PaddyF wrote:Lictor not rolling on deep strike mishap table because they always have to deep strike into cover.

they don't now... they just take dangerous terrain tests

As toMurphy's OP, I'm not that familiar with nids, but from a none nid player, the shift towards troops in every army has certainly seemed to water the nids down a bit, along with the new LOS rules means they can't run up behind woods anymore not seen at all. Yes they get cover saves, but not been seen at all was better I think.

A few hangover ideas
Relative cost increases for 5th ed.. troops would cost more (although you might offset this against orks they were 4th ed and that they already cost a fair bit).. FA and elites would cost mildly less (if you followed 5th ed over orks).
Reintroduce some of the special characters (old one eye etc) and the strangle web etc... they were fairly early on chapter approved additions for it that really add a flavour to it. Possibly special characters would morph the FOC (so tyranid warriors as troops should stay if you take special warrior X.. For this style of army you would pay well over what the statline for this HQ is worth.. This could also apply to certain broodlords.. may they gain control over the outflank like like boss snikrot. Or maybe just gives the whole army scuttlers for free.. the HQ would cost around 250 though)
I'd give them reliable anti tank or a method of getting to the enemy faster..CC isn't what 5th ed is about.. and if it is it comes out of a landraider... Possibly up the cost of certain mass creatures and turn them into cavalry.this could actually be done across the board (but then starts sounding horribly like that homebrew eldar codex where they all cost the same but all ride horses so double their movement).. Or add +1 to all S..but keep the only glancing stuff
Radically raise the price of feeder tendrils to take account of it now being the only good thing.
Make carnifexs come with some of their options by defualt and raise their cost.. you can still make them do everything but their relative cost for doing everything goes up.
Raise the BS of zoenthropes, or make them like the demon codex in that they don't take a psychic test and raise their points.
I'd possibly add a deepstrike rule about burrowing for a troops choice.

The idea is bringing it into line post harlie, orks, demons and still keep them unique and compensating for rending and loss of pinball safety of CC that 4th ed gave (once you hit their lines you were safe) I think comparing a few of the units to slannesh demons points and skills wise might be a good idea?
killpoints- would be handy to know what guard are doing.. if it really is a whole platoon =1killpoint.. then possibly subsequent without number will still only count as one killpoint (because they are all just part of the same swarm)

If that all sounds poop..sunday morning itus

some suggestions:

what if you allowed Warriors to be taken as Troops (as well as the existing options), but not to count against the minimum FOC requirements?

what if you grouped Zoanthropes (and Biovores?) together, isntead of having them split into separate units?

what if you gave the Lictor Infiltrate instead of its special DS rule, and allowed it to count as being out of LOS for the purposes of Infiltration if it sets up within a Terrain piece?

~ Tim

1. Hormagaunts no longer classified as beasts so they can move onto the upper floors of ruins.
2. Broodlords given fleet USR. Their genestealer retinues have it already so they should to. Either that or make them a HQ choice and IC without having to take only genestealers as a retinue.
3. Eliminate spore mines clusters as fast attack FOC. Make them ammunition fired by biovores that if they scatter becomes mines floating on the table. Therefore they are ammo and never units, and never give up KPs.

There's my 3.

TW

timewizard wrote:1. Hormagaunts no longer classified as beasts so they can move onto the upper floors of ruins.

but that would slow them down.

why not just give them a special rule allowing them to move up and down in Ruins despite being Beasts? maybe even give them a special rule like Harlie Flip Belts to represent the fact that they can leap over Terrain?

timewizard wrote:2. Broodlords given fleet USR. Their genestealer retinues have it already so they should to.

so first-turn-charge with a combat monster IC and his combat monster retinue?

if you wanted Fleeting Broodlords then i think they should lose Infiltrate.
(that was the very point of them not getting Fleet in the first place, AFAIK)

timewizard wrote:3. Eliminate spore mines clusters as fast attack FOC. Make them ammunition fired by biovores that if they scatter becomes mines floating on the table. Therefore they are ammo and never units, and never give up KPs.

im not sure that stops them giving up KP anyway, but if you dont want them giving up KP just say "they arent worth KP".

personally i like the idea of clusters being fired from off table. i would rather keep them. maybe remove them as a unit choice (so they dont take up space on the FOC) and simply add them as an army special rule? either have so many mines deployed on the table before the enemy sets up (like SM Scout Bike booby traps) or have them come down on a certain roll every turn (maybe within LOS of a Synapse Creature)?

thoughts?

~ Tim

LordMalekTheRedKnight wrote:

timewizard wrote:1. Hormagaunts no longer classified as beasts so they can move onto the upper floors of ruins.

but that would slow them down.

why not just give them a special rule allowing them to move up and down in Ruins despite being Beasts? maybe even give them a special rule like Harlie Flip Belts to represent the fact that they can leap over Terrain?

Or just give them fleet?

LordMalekTheRedKnight wrote:

timewizard wrote:2. Broodlords given fleet USR. Their genestealer retinues have it already so they should to.

so first-turn-charge with a combat monster IC and his combat monster retinue?

if you wanted Fleeting Broodlords then i think they should lose Infiltrate.
(that was the very point of them not getting Fleet in the first place, AFAIK)

Good point.

LordMalekTheRedKnight wrote:

timewizard wrote:3. Eliminate spore mines clusters as fast attack FOC. Make them ammunition fired by biovores that if they scatter becomes mines floating on the table. Therefore they are ammo and never units, and never give up KPs.

im not sure that stops them giving up KP anyway, but if you dont want them giving up KP just say "they arent worth KP".

personally i like the idea of clusters being fired from off table. i would rather keep them. maybe remove them as a unit choice (so they dont take up space on the FOC) and simply add them as an army special rule? either have so many mines deployed on the table before the enemy sets up (like SM Scout Bike booby traps) or have them come down on a certain roll every turn (maybe within LOS of a Synapse Creature)?

thoughts?

~ Tim

But if they are ammo fired from biovores, then you can choose whether to field biovores or not. And the enemy has the option of attacking the biovore to stop the appearance of additional spore mines.
I like the idea of having them be fired from off the table as well though. That's an interesting concept as well.
I think the most important rule change for spore mines thought is still for them to not be worth any KPs.

TW

timewizard wrote:Or just give them fleet?

they would still be slower than they are now (Beasts get Fleet and double charge range, and roll an extra D6 for Fallback moves).

timewizard wrote:I think the most important rule change for spore mines thought is still for them to not be worth any KPs.

agreed.

~ Tim

KInG wrote:

Angelwing wrote:And number four bonus: Pics of non studio armies in painting section.

interesting one, why's that?

The older 3rd ed codexes had pics of non studio armies in them to show different ways of collecting the army. It's good to show armies that contain conversions and that are not 'eavy metal quality to show what can be realistically achieved by Joe Bloggs. Of course these should not replace the 'eavy metal studio army pics or the page of gaunts showing different colour schemes.

Some examples: 3rd ed space marine book had Alan Merrets and Paul sawyers forces, while 3rd ed orks had Andy Chambers and Adrian Woods armies, all showing very different ways to collect the same army, but were also interesting to look at and pinch modelling ideas from.

I think the main issue is the change to cover rules. The models for guants/hormaguants are so small and/or posed so flat that they don't obsure half the model for anything else. so they don't give cover saves.

What about adapting the "shoot the big ones" rule to make guant morphs give a cover save against anything shooting through them. Much like the old grot living shield rules?

lostandthedamned wrote:The models for guants/hormaguants are so small and/or posed so flat that they don't obsure half the model for anything else. so they don't give cover saves.

dont forget its only the MCs that are affected by this: the Warriors, Zoans etc can get cover from them.

that said, maybe this could be incorporated into the Leaping rule? maybe say that even shots passing over units with Leaping count as passing through them, and that MCs being shot at through units with Leaping get Cover saves from them.

~ Tim

LordMalekTheRedKnight wrote:

timewizard wrote:1. Hormagaunts no longer classified as beasts so they can move onto the upper floors of ruins.

but that would slow them down.

why not just give them a special rule allowing them to move up and down in Ruins despite being Beasts? maybe even give them a special rule like Harlie Flip Belts to represent the fact that they can leap over Terrain?

Good idea.. isn't it the frag grenade ones that let them move up vertical surfaces..(having problems if they stop half way up a 12" tower)..maybe that upgrade could be finished off and made available to those who move as cavalry/beasts