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Gate of Infinity

Discussion of rules in Warhammer 40K - use for existing rules only, for discussing new rules or changes/alternatives use the Rules Development forum

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Re: Gate of Infinity

Postby timewizard » Wed Jan 12, 2011 1:50 pm

Morning all,
Well, to start, I don't think there is anything which prevents a librarian from using GoI while inside a transport.
I further think the rules back up the fact that units in transports are indeed "on the table" even though that term is not specifically used in the rulebook.

Ruffian alludes to a discussion on Warseer from last month. One of the points I made was:
Even though the units in transports and buildings have been "removed from the table" for model placement purposes, at the end of the game they are not "off the table" for kill point purposes. Looking through the rulebook, the only reference I can find to units being off the table is in the reserve section, the last paragraph under rolling for reserves on page 94 where we are told we can't delay rolling for reserves and can't keep them "...hanging around off-table until you decide you need them!" This would indicate that only units in reserve are considered to be "off the table".

Are units in transports "off the table"? The rules seem to indicate it. In the transport section, the rules tell us the models are "...removed from the table and placed aside...". It does the same thing for occupying buildings where when models occupy a building they "...are removed from the table..." and the Space Marine Librarian GoI rule that says the Librarian and a unit he might be joined to "...are removed from the tabletop..." but does this mean these units are "removed from play"? No because they can fire from inside the transport, use psychic powers from inside the transport, they can even be hit be a weapon. Reference page 80 BRB Template weapons used on units in buildings where if a building's fire point falls under a template the unit occupying the building suffers D6 hits. So clearly the unit in the building ("embarked") is "in play" even if not physically "on the table".

Of course, this raises the next question if "Can a librarian use GoI from inside a building?". And I think it can, just the same as teleporting form inside a vehicle.
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Re: Gate of Infinity

Postby Herne » Wed Jan 12, 2011 5:37 pm

So if I chose to place my models on top of a rhino rather than removing them from the board whilst they are embarked in said rhino, does that indicate the models are still both in play and on the board? :twisted:

Rules aside - I am right in saying that a Rhino is hermetically sealed against the elements arent I? Reason I ask is that I jsut have this image in my mind of the librarian and his unit inside the transport teleporting out, leaving a vacuum where their forms had previously been. (See what happens to Lorgars towertop library when Magnus teleports out of it in 'First Heretic' due to air displacement!) Cue to a couple of hours later - image of a techmarine with a huge crowbar trying to get the vacuum sealed side hatch open, fingers around hatch frame, feet firmly planted either side of the hatch grunting with effort ande grumbling about 'dang librarians!' :lol: :lol:
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Re: Gate of Infinity

Postby timewizard » Wed Jan 12, 2011 6:11 pm

Herne wrote: So if I chose to place my models on top of a rhino rather than removing them from the board whilst they are embarked in said rhino, does that indicate the models are still both in play and on the board? :twisted:

It really doesn't matter how you indicate that the models have embarked. BRB page 66 under embarking says "When the unit embarks, it is removed from the table and placed aside, making a note or otherwise marking that the unit is being transported (we find that placing one of the unit's models on top of the transport works well!)". The unit, even though "...removed form the table..." is still "in play" because it is embarked in the vehicle. It still interracts with the game, can take damage if the vehicle is destroyed-explodes, and can use certain abilities (shooting, assaulting, psycher abilities) if allowed within the rules.

Herne wrote:Rules aside - I am right in saying that a Rhino is hermetically sealed against the elements arent I?
Of course, until the access point hatches or fire points are opened! :wink:
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Re: Gate of Infinity

Postby killmaimburn » Wed Jan 12, 2011 6:29 pm

Open the back door ,I'm about to set off a librarian.
Having worked in libraries this pleases me.
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