Not only is the new model really nice, but ever since I read the rules for them I kind of liked them, though I've never used them in a game yet (probably coz there was no model and I couldn't be bothered to convert one).

I was hoping that we could take a look at this units pluses and minuses. Not only that, the 5 scouts bundled up inside it, how would you arm them and deploy them. They are a troop choice, so surely grabbing objectives, which 5th is all about, is something on its own makes this unit worth a look.

Let's have your thoughts

I have been considering giving the Storm-mounted Scouts Bolters, a Heavy Bolter, Sergeant, and Camo Cloaks. The idea being that they will move in, take up position on the Objective, and try to hold off the enemy until reinforcements arrive.

I'd need to have a look at it again to see the rules and options but on first read I imagined it was a swoop down and take the objetive kind of thing. I imagined scouts with shotguns dropping and unloading before assaulting onto the objective.

well, im slightly dubious!

The fact is im going to eventually get some as i like the model, however what impact would a 5 man scout squad have on a captured objective? the most i would hope for would be to contest.

A tactical advantage could arise if you backed them up with other landspeeders HB equipped or a supporting combat squad.

They offer a very good tactical flexibility, however dont have a hard enough hit considering most armies would have a main infantry squad on a obj and if they have more than 5....well good bye scouts.

however ive not fielded loads of scouts before so this comes from my impression of their rules and abilites.....might order some

Elvis

I imagine an objective held by another small unit (say eldar rangers for example) would be just what the scouts and storm would be good for taking.

If only the Scouts could be given Flamers.

I can actually see two types of units, and they could even work well together. Two Storms with a Combat Scout squad in one and a Fire Support Scout Squad in the other. They may work well at taking out an Objective holding unit, and then allow the Fire Support unit to hold the Objective whilst the Comabt unit provides a screening unit to protect them from Assault.

Ach. I must stop this discussion. I already have stuff to work on for my Chaos and Catachan armies and my mate's Brettonians. I don't need to be drawn back to my Space Marines . . . or Tau . . . or Adeptus Mechanicus . . . or . . . huh. That's all that I have to work on. I guess it isn't that much after all.

Culven wrote:If only the Scouts could be given Flamers.

Well, the speeder can be given a heavy flamer and the sgt can get a combi-flamer. Does that help?

I like the idea of 2 storms, one fitted for assault and one with a HB with hellfire rounds. First one assaults and takes the objective, 2nd holds it. First unit can then go on to grab another objective.

timewizard wrote:

Culven wrote:If only the Scouts could be given Flamers.

Well, the speeder can be given a heavy flamer and the sgt can get a combi-flamer. Does that help?

Not really. In my pyromaniac's fantasy, the Sergeant would have a Combi-Flamer, three Scouts would have Flamers, and the Heavy Weapon Scout would have a Heavy Flamer.

I guess it will have to do.

yes tw, you have my idea there almost. but my two units would both be assaulty. 10 scouts with 2x powerfists, 2x combi flamer, shotguns and the speeders both with heavy flamers.

the 2 units can be used together on tougher objectives, or if lightly defended, maybe 2. but i struggle whether to scout them (probably if im going 1st), or out flank them, as they could be on late, and do i hold off till late in game, or go on the offensive straight away?

with their ds denial, it might be good to keep them close to your key objectives in a defence role 1st, then back up and support other units at objective taking towards the later turns

these are my thoughts so far...

The "traditional" (as in competitative and once it was bigged up everyone did it )way (brought to most folks attention by fixer GT heat 3 this year) is
5 man scout squad BPand CCWS for bulk attacks, sargent has a power fist and since BP doesn't add an attack either a combi weapon or a shotgun points dependant) in storm with flamer (or melta especially if in a hestan list)

Downsides- its a fast attack slot, and everything in the fast attack slot of smurfs is the gold that your digging for,its your fast attack melta, its your mass fire, its your cheap mobility..its your mech.

scout 'turn' it burns flat out (gaining a cover save) and then in his first turn it goes for a soft spot and ties them up
(I've been the neighsayer in a lot of the threads about this so IIRC.. against 10 man CSM- total waste, against oblits its good (very good- near optimal) against tanks its good especially if you add melta bombs- its like a shrike thing..but you have to lock to something else too to protect yourself a bit.(maximise life expectation).5 man tactical squads will melt- but your not getting your points back or any tactical benefit, don't go for dreads..some people believe it has potential against monsterous creatures..I disagree..but see the merit in tying up the lash turn one. The -2 modifier for leadership is ok (worth bearing in mind when deciding what to go against, not much else).
THe icon jammer is ridiculously rude RAW wise it has *potentially* the ability to switch off the icon of nurgle thats keeping your boys at T5.
http://www.warseer.com/forums/showthrea ... storm+icon (a rather brutal reading of it, but can only be countered by threats and arguments over intent, rather than by a raw counter)

Heres fixers tactica http://www.warseer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=188634 on how to use them, I expect to see a few people trying it given a quick glance at dakka and WS, I have the models (for fixers list) on my shelf, I want to see what it does.


Heavybolter with template and snipers is meh to ok, but doesn't benefit from the storm. Then we slip into how crap scouts are in 5th..and I get bored having already written 12 pages on it

lol thx toby, some nice stuff here... will go read fixer's thread now.

some good ideas/thoughts there... I'm seeing my 2 storm's (almost built now ) shooting across the field in support of my Iron Clad in his DP, all converging 1st turn on the enemy in one massive overwelming assault, before he's even had chance to move... and I'm liking it alot!

poo! my idea wont work, coz theres a little matter of; the diff between a teleport homer and a locator beacon. seems what i really need is a scout bike squad

Scout bikes really aren't where its at.. 120 points just so that a drop pod that already reduces scatter may reduce scatter further (to nill) if you get to go first and your opponent doesn't wipe them out going first.?
I think they are fun..(as you can tell my 5th ed smurf thing has been all about bikes and I played scout bikes in various combos about 7 times) but bless they are poo.
Good points,
- they have and they shall know no fear (no sweeping when they lose) but no retreat on 4+s suck.
-They have combat tactics, if you live long enough for them to be considering being assualted by the enemy choosing to fall back 3d6 (after losing some folks to shooting) is possibly one of the safest uses of combat tactics in the game.(and then autoregroup due to ATSKNF)
They have frag and krak (which I must admit I forgot when I used them, and is very handy- in terms of first turn hitting av10 leman russ rear armour and in terms of charging gunlines in cover).

Bad points majority WS3, hitting guard on 4s and presumably facing 25+ of them.(point for point)
Krak upgrade rapid firing shot is ap4,(although 6 blast templates is fun- it can stop you charging to safety)..
Common RAW view is that the sargent can't take the grenade launcher (meaning I was cheating a fair amount of time I used them)
Dangerous terrain when moving into terrain to get those squishy underbelly units sucks.

With basic scouts- a lot of folks just say meh- ally with sisters of battle better.(shame since I have about 45 scouts inc talismans cyber girl (counts as telion))

You just have to ask what complementary targets will you be assualting to provide support, where will they be and what are the likely outcomes of such investments in FA slots and points.
(I gave up on them with "You just kind of want something with such a big sack of rules to be able to do something...more")
That said..I still think they are one of the more fun units in the codex, and would love to face them this weekend

What's the issue with the serg taking the grenade launcher? No codex to check the wording....
I have 6 scout bikes to assemble and paint up (3 old and 3 new) and was going to have 3 with grenade lanchers, one with the serg.