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And the door slams shut

Anything to do with Space Hulk, either the old versions or the recently released new version

And the door slams shut

Postby Ben » Wed Sep 16, 2009 8:11 pm

According to the website...

Sold Out Online!

Our warehouse is empty. All remaining copies of Space Hulk have been shipped to Games Workshop stores and Independent Stockists around the US and Canada. Don't miss out on your chance to own this classic board game - get down to your local store today.

http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/conte ... d=4400018a

With the website now sold out the only place you can get a copy is in stores! So, get down to your local Hobby Center this weekend, or miss out forever!

~~~~~

I question the wisdom of paying for a large fixed cost production in plastic for a limited run.

If I were a really nerdy business guy, I would suggest having the sprues available as well as other sprues of floors (copied from COD) so that they can continue production with minimal marginal costs. They can then have expansions which are for other Xeno threats (Orks etc), other Imperial boarders (Deathwing with slightly different rules), and even add RT scavengers with a rush to the resources mission set (Necromunda in space).

Good thing I am not a nerdy business guy. If so I would have graphs to support that.
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Re: And the door slams shut

Postby Socaddict » Wed Sep 16, 2009 8:48 pm

They've been sold out online for a while now. In fairness, I'm kinda glad that its staying as a limited production run, as it means that my spare copy might be worth something soon.

I do hope they make the models available to buy separately sometime though.
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Re: And the door slams shut

Postby Ben » Wed Sep 16, 2009 8:55 pm

They could do a new box that is all controlled by them (no contracting for bristols and printing for instance). The thing is they are geared for large runs since they have high fixed costs and minimal variable costs. The marginal cost of one more unit is tiny so it is better for them to sell as many as possible.

I do understand you wanting a future arbitrage situation. I have done that many times with GW products such as the 40K RPG rulebook that sold out and was then declared to be unsupported because the ink was not yet dry on the contract for the other firm to take over. While it would be nice for my still in shrinkwrap extra copy, for the firm it is better to have those units selling for as long as possible.

For the record I do know that there are advantages to "limited time only" offers but this is not the best economy to make such an offer particularly when the customers have other items (such as new terrain that just came out) that they could be buying instead.
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Re: And the door slams shut

Postby Socaddict » Wed Sep 16, 2009 11:06 pm

These arguments were repeated ad infinatum on the warseer thread. I think what it ended up boiling down to was that while it could make sense for them to extend the run, The only things produced in house (where GW get stuff cheapest) were the plastic models. Everything else required an external supplier. And another fact that came up, was that its better to have a smaller run and sell out, than a larger order and have some products left sitting on shelves gathering dust.
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Re: And the door slams shut

Postby LordMalekTheRedKnight » Wed Sep 16, 2009 11:27 pm

Just because the game itself is Ltd, doesnt mean the models are. ;)

I can imagine the Blood Angels being sold (either as a bits pack or a boxed set) when the BA get a proper codex. The Genestealers... well they would probably suit a Kill Team expansion release or something.

Failing that, just bung 'em on the website and let people buy the sprues as-is. They can add them to their armies or bulk up their SH collections. :)

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Re: And the door slams shut

Postby Ben » Thu Sep 17, 2009 12:43 am

Socaddict wrote:These arguments were repeated ad infinatum on the warseer thread. I think what it ended up boiling down to was that while it could make sense for them to extend the run, The only things produced in house (where GW get stuff cheapest) were the plastic models. Everything else required an external supplier. And another fact that came up, was that its better to have a smaller run and sell out, than a larger order and have some products left sitting on shelves gathering dust.


Right but I was saying that they could have easily went with plastic tiles for the floors and kept that in house as well. GW made a choice to use card which is no doubt due to cost but it is not uncommon for GW to take actions that make those of use with manufacturing or accounting background to just shake our heads.

LordMalekTheRedKnight wrote:Just because the game itself is Ltd, doesnt mean the models are. ;)

I can imagine the Blood Angels being sold (either as a bits pack or a boxed set) when the BA get a proper codex. The Genestealers... well they would probably suit a Kill Team expansion release or something.

Failing that, just bung 'em on the website and let people buy the sprues as-is. They can add them to their armies or bulk up their SH collections. :)

~ Tim


I know that they could but to me it was very short sighted to go though all of that design, mold manufacturing, and production to shut down that quickly. I am not saying that they lost money as I am sure they did not (just looking at the price vs the cost of materials) but it just seems to be another of "those" decisions.

Much like how GW will make some great items and then price it so that people look on with shock.
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Re: And the door slams shut

Postby Socaddict » Thu Sep 17, 2009 9:40 am

If they made plastic floor tiles, we would have had to have paid even more for the set, and making it even heavier (when it was already about 3.7kg), and £60 was about the limit that most people would consider spending on a single board game, even those of us used to GW's prices. Plus the card sections mean that I can get on with playing it while It looks nice straight out of the box, rather than having to paint the board sections (which would then get chipped and damaged during play and while setting up and taking it apart). And its some DAMN nice card. And that might also have increased the sprue count beyond a number they were willing to make for just one box (IIRC wasn't one of the problems with the stompa getting it all onto a set number of sprues?).

And you still haven't made a comment about my smaller production run selling out vs larger production run not selling all of it, and thereby wasting both money and space for GW.
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Re: And the door slams shut

Postby LordMalekTheRedKnight » Thu Sep 17, 2009 10:19 am

When I envisioned GW re-releasing SH, I expected them to do it as cheaply as possible, i.e.:
- AoBR Termies
- BFM Stealers
- CoD Floor Tiles (they make perfect "squares" for 40mm bases)
- Plastic counters (like the 40K counter set)

This would have kept costs down (and meant no external suppliers), but would have increased the amount of space needed to play, and wouldnt have looked that great (especially "out of the box").

Instead however, they seem to have pulled the stops out to showcase what they are capable of doing. Personally, I am glad they did it this way, even if it did mean it "had" to be a limited run. :)

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Re: And the door slams shut

Postby Ben » Thu Sep 17, 2009 2:41 pm

Socaddict wrote:If they made plastic floor tiles, we would have had to have paid even more for the set, and making it even heavier (when it was already about 3.7kg), and £60 was about the limit that most people would consider spending on a single board game, even those of us used to GW's prices. Plus the card sections mean that I can get on with playing it while It looks nice straight out of the box, rather than having to paint the board sections (which would then get chipped and damaged during play and while setting up and taking it apart). And its some DAMN nice card. And that might also have increased the sprue count beyond a number they were willing to make for just one box (IIRC wasn't one of the problems with the stompa getting it all onto a set number of sprues?).


There is no reason to claim that plastic floor tiles would require a higher price. As it was they had to buy card, printing, embossing, and shipping. Having worked for their box supplier I know that they paid quite a bit for that. The cost of production for plastic is minimal especially when it is existing parts. They chose to go with card (IMHO) to make it look like the old one.

I am sure the sprue decision is X number for developing a sprue times Y sprues and they don't want to exceed a threshold of development cost for a single item because of the payback required. They do have debt to service.

Socaddict wrote:And you still haven't made a comment about my smaller production run selling out vs larger production run not selling all of it, and thereby wasting both money and space for GW.


Not much to address. Smaller production run selling out means you have lost sales. Larger production runs not selling out means you have warehouse space requirements. They have warehouse space sitting idle in Memphis so that is a sunk cost so the only incremental cost would potentially be the increase in insurance but then the existing insurance may be more than sufficient for that slight increase in value. GW chose to go "limited edition" for marketing reasons and not financial. That or they have idiots in financing.

Then again I have worked in capital financing for manufacturers and have seen other times when marketing has lead to other such decisions.
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Re: And the door slams shut

Postby Ben » Thu Sep 17, 2009 2:44 pm

LordMalekTheRedKnight wrote:When I envisioned GW re-releasing SH, I expected them to do it as cheaply as possible, i.e.:
- AoBR Termies
- BFM Stealers
- CoD Floor Tiles (they make perfect "squares" for 40mm bases)
- Plastic counters (like the 40K counter set)

This would have kept costs down (and meant no external suppliers), but would have increased the amount of space needed to play, and wouldnt have looked that great (especially "out of the box").

Instead however, they seem to have pulled the stops out to showcase what they are capable of doing. Personally, I am glad they did it this way, even if it did mean it "had" to be a limited run. :)

~ Tim


It didn't have to be a limited run anyway. Just like before with SpaceHulk and DungeonQuest which were available in Toys R Us, this could have been used to expand their market but this was not to grow the base but to enhance sales to existing customers with some sales to former customers with low probability of continuing as customers (known affectionately as crusty vets).
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Re: And the door slams shut

Postby mattjgilbert » Thu Sep 17, 2009 8:36 pm

I think they went with card because it meant they ould deliver a board that was full colour artwork. Shipping grey plastic board sections would look terribly offputting. I don't think I'd want to play on a board like that.
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Re: And the door slams shut

Postby Ben » Thu Sep 17, 2009 11:50 pm

Could be.

Could also be they are pretending they can't grow and did this as a throw to the existing market. Sort of viewing the UK as all that GW will have and since the UK is a mature market treat all markets as a mature market.

I am not saying there was no reason for GW to do card. I am saying that purposefully doing a limited run was the poor choice given the structure of their manufacturing process.
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Re: And the door slams shut

Postby LordMalekTheRedKnight » Fri Sep 18, 2009 10:14 am

I must amit, I am suprise that this isnt being pushed in Toys R Us and Argos... (being a limited run kinda scuppers that idea)

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Re: And the door slams shut

Postby Ben » Fri Sep 18, 2009 10:39 am

It is academic anyway (funny that coming from me :) ) but I should stop being surprised by GW.

Either way, it is good that it was made as it is a good game.

Did anyone "leak" the total production number?
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Re: And the door slams shut

Postby Socaddict » Fri Sep 18, 2009 11:21 am

I've heard 10,000 and 25,000 bandied abut, sometimes with 25,000 as the overall amount, and 10,000 as the amount the UK got, and sometimes I've heard vastly different numbers.
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